diff --git a/include/light/trace_embree.hh b/include/light/trace_embree.hh
index af1e8a34..d0d17172 100644
--- a/include/light/trace_embree.hh
+++ b/include/light/trace_embree.hh
@@ -24,12 +24,15 @@
 #include <common/log.hh> // for FError
 
 #include <vector>
+#include <set>
 
 struct mbsp_t;
 class modelinfo_t;
+struct mface_t;
 
 void ResetEmbree();
 void Embree_TraceInit(const mbsp_t *bsp);
+const std::set<const mface_t *> &ShadowCastingSolidFacesSet();
 
 class raystream_embree_common_t
 {
diff --git a/light/bounce.cc b/light/bounce.cc
index c90f7d81..f1c97795 100644
--- a/light/bounce.cc
+++ b/light/bounce.cc
@@ -28,6 +28,7 @@
 #include <light/ltface.hh>
 #include <light/surflight.hh>
 #include <light/trace.hh> // for Light_PointInLeaf
+#include <light/trace_embree.hh> // for ShadowCastingSolidFacesSet
 
 #include <common/polylib.hh>
 #include <common/bsputils.hh>
@@ -42,10 +43,13 @@
 static bool Face_ShouldBounce(const mbsp_t *bsp, const mface_t *face)
 {
     // make bounce light, only if this face is shadow casting
-    const modelinfo_t *mi = ModelInfoForFace(bsp, Face_GetNum(bsp, face));
-    if (!mi || !mi->shadow.boolValue()) {
+
+    // NOTE: this should be the same set of faces that are unconditionally shadow casting
+    // (so exclude fences, water, etc.) which is why we're currently fetching it from the embree
+    // code, because the condition is quite complex and we don't want to try to repeat it here.
+    auto &face_set = ShadowCastingSolidFacesSet();
+    if (face_set.find(face) == face_set.end())
         return false;
-    }
 
     if (!Face_IsLightmapped(bsp, face)) {
         return false;
@@ -67,14 +71,6 @@ static bool Face_ShouldBounce(const mbsp_t *bsp, const mface_t *face)
         return false;
     }
 
-    // don't bounce from faces on non-default object channels
-    if (mi->object_channel_mask.value() != CHANNEL_MASK_DEFAULT) {
-        return false;
-    }
-    if (ext_info.object_channel_mask.value_or(CHANNEL_MASK_DEFAULT) != CHANNEL_MASK_DEFAULT) {
-        return false;
-    }
-
     return true;
 }
 
diff --git a/light/trace_embree.cc b/light/trace_embree.cc
index 3a541c07..ce06b807 100644
--- a/light/trace_embree.cc
+++ b/light/trace_embree.cc
@@ -26,11 +26,15 @@
 #include <common/polylib.hh>
 #include <vector>
 #include <climits>
+#include <set>
 
 sceneinfo skygeom; // sky. always occludes.
 sceneinfo solidgeom; // solids. always occludes.
 sceneinfo filtergeom; // conditional occluders.. needs to run ray intersection filter
 
+// set of faces in `solidgeom`,
+std::set<const mface_t *> shadow_casting_solid_faces;
+
 static RTCDevice device;
 RTCScene scene;
 
@@ -41,6 +45,7 @@ void ResetEmbree()
     skygeom = {};
     solidgeom = {};
     filtergeom = {};
+    shadow_casting_solid_faces = {};
 
     if (scene) {
         rtcReleaseScene(scene);
@@ -55,6 +60,12 @@ void ResetEmbree()
     bsp_static = nullptr;
 }
 
+const std::set<const mface_t *> &ShadowCastingSolidFacesSet()
+{
+    return shadow_casting_solid_faces;
+}
+
+
 /**
  * Returns 1.0 unless a custom alpha value is set.
  * The priority is: "_light_alpha" (read from extended_texinfo_flags), then "alpha", then Q2 surface flags
@@ -675,6 +686,11 @@ void Embree_TraceInit(const mbsp_t *bsp)
 
     rtcCommitScene(scene);
 
+    // keep a backup of solidfaces
+    for (const mface_t *face : solidfaces) {
+        shadow_casting_solid_faces.insert(face);
+    }
+
     logging::funcprint("\n");
     logging::print("\t{} sky faces\n", skyfaces.size());
     logging::print("\t{} solid faces\n", solidfaces.size());
diff --git a/testmaps/q1_light_bounce_litwater.map b/testmaps/q1_light_bounce_litwater.map
new file mode 100644
index 00000000..cdeb7c44
--- /dev/null
+++ b/testmaps/q1_light_bounce_litwater.map
@@ -0,0 +1,86 @@
+// Game: Quake
+// Format: Valve
+// entity 0
+{
+"classname" "worldspawn"
+"wad" "deprecated/free_wad.wad"
+"_tb_def" "builtin:Quake.fgd"
+// brush 0
+{
+( -416 -128 32 ) ( -416 -127 32 ) ( -416 -128 33 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -416 -208 32 ) ( -416 -208 33 ) ( -415 -208 32 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -416 -128 32 ) ( -415 -128 32 ) ( -416 -127 32 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 48 ) ( 128 273 48 ) ( 129 272 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 48 ) ( 129 272 48 ) ( 128 272 49 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 48 ) ( 128 272 49 ) ( 128 273 48 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+// brush 1
+{
+( -416 -128 288 ) ( -416 -127 288 ) ( -416 -128 289 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -416 -208 288 ) ( -416 -208 289 ) ( -415 -208 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -416 -128 288 ) ( -415 -128 288 ) ( -416 -127 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 304 ) ( 128 273 304 ) ( 129 272 304 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 304 ) ( 129 272 304 ) ( 128 272 305 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 304 ) ( 128 272 305 ) ( 128 273 304 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+// brush 2
+{
+( -432 -128 272 ) ( -432 -127 272 ) ( -432 -128 273 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -432 -208 272 ) ( -432 -208 273 ) ( -431 -208 272 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -432 -128 48 ) ( -431 -128 48 ) ( -432 -127 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 112 272 288 ) ( 112 273 288 ) ( 113 272 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 112 272 288 ) ( 113 272 288 ) ( 112 272 289 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -416 272 288 ) ( -416 272 289 ) ( -416 273 288 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+// brush 3
+{
+( 128 -128 272 ) ( 128 -127 272 ) ( 128 -128 273 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 -208 272 ) ( 128 -208 273 ) ( 129 -208 272 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 -128 48 ) ( 129 -128 48 ) ( 128 -127 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 672 272 288 ) ( 672 273 288 ) ( 673 272 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 672 272 288 ) ( 673 272 288 ) ( 672 272 289 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 144 272 288 ) ( 144 272 289 ) ( 144 273 288 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+// brush 4
+{
+( -416 -144 272 ) ( -416 -143 272 ) ( -416 -144 273 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 96 -224 272 ) ( 96 -224 273 ) ( 97 -224 272 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 96 -144 48 ) ( 97 -144 48 ) ( 96 -143 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 640 256 288 ) ( 640 257 288 ) ( 641 256 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 640 -208 288 ) ( 641 -208 288 ) ( 640 -208 289 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 256 288 ) ( 128 256 289 ) ( 128 257 288 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+// brush 5
+{
+( -416 256 48 ) ( -416 257 48 ) ( -416 256 49 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -432 256 48 ) ( -432 256 49 ) ( -431 256 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -432 256 48 ) ( -431 256 48 ) ( -432 257 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 288 ) ( 128 273 288 ) ( 129 272 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 64 ) ( 129 272 64 ) ( 128 272 65 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 64 ) ( 128 272 65 ) ( 128 273 64 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+}
+// entity 1
+{
+"classname" "info_player_start"
+"origin" "-292 0 72"
+}
+// entity 2
+{
+"classname" "light"
+"origin" "-136 24 148"
+"delay" "2"
+}
+// entity 3
+{
+"classname" "func_detail"
+// brush 0
+{
+( 0 112 48 ) ( 0 113 48 ) ( 0 112 49 ) *swater5 [ 0 -1 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 0 -208 48 ) ( 0 -208 49 ) ( 1 -208 48 ) *swater5 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 0 112 48 ) ( 1 112 48 ) ( 0 113 48 ) *swater5 [ -1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 256 288 ) ( 128 257 288 ) ( 129 256 288 ) *swater5 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 256 64 ) ( 129 256 64 ) ( 128 256 65 ) *swater5 [ -1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 256 64 ) ( 128 256 65 ) ( 128 257 64 ) *swater5 [ 0 1 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+}
diff --git a/testmaps/q1_light_bounce_noshadow.map b/testmaps/q1_light_bounce_noshadow.map
new file mode 100644
index 00000000..e64dcbb4
--- /dev/null
+++ b/testmaps/q1_light_bounce_noshadow.map
@@ -0,0 +1,88 @@
+// Game: Quake
+// Format: Valve
+// entity 0
+{
+"classname" "worldspawn"
+"wad" "deprecated/free_wad.wad;deprecated/fence.wad"
+"_tb_def" "builtin:Quake.fgd"
+// brush 0
+{
+( -416 -128 32 ) ( -416 -127 32 ) ( -416 -128 33 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -416 -208 32 ) ( -416 -208 33 ) ( -415 -208 32 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -416 -128 32 ) ( -415 -128 32 ) ( -416 -127 32 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 48 ) ( 128 273 48 ) ( 129 272 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 48 ) ( 129 272 48 ) ( 128 272 49 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 48 ) ( 128 272 49 ) ( 128 273 48 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+// brush 1
+{
+( -416 -128 288 ) ( -416 -127 288 ) ( -416 -128 289 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -416 -208 288 ) ( -416 -208 289 ) ( -415 -208 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -416 -128 288 ) ( -415 -128 288 ) ( -416 -127 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 304 ) ( 128 273 304 ) ( 129 272 304 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 304 ) ( 129 272 304 ) ( 128 272 305 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 304 ) ( 128 272 305 ) ( 128 273 304 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+// brush 2
+{
+( -432 -128 272 ) ( -432 -127 272 ) ( -432 -128 273 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -432 -208 272 ) ( -432 -208 273 ) ( -431 -208 272 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -432 -128 48 ) ( -431 -128 48 ) ( -432 -127 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 112 272 288 ) ( 112 273 288 ) ( 113 272 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 112 272 288 ) ( 113 272 288 ) ( 112 272 289 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -416 272 288 ) ( -416 272 289 ) ( -416 273 288 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+// brush 3
+{
+( 128 -128 272 ) ( 128 -127 272 ) ( 128 -128 273 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 -208 272 ) ( 128 -208 273 ) ( 129 -208 272 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 -128 48 ) ( 129 -128 48 ) ( 128 -127 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 672 272 288 ) ( 672 273 288 ) ( 673 272 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 672 272 288 ) ( 673 272 288 ) ( 672 272 289 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 144 272 288 ) ( 144 272 289 ) ( 144 273 288 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+// brush 4
+{
+( -416 -144 272 ) ( -416 -143 272 ) ( -416 -144 273 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 96 -224 272 ) ( 96 -224 273 ) ( 97 -224 272 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 96 -144 48 ) ( 97 -144 48 ) ( 96 -143 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 640 256 288 ) ( 640 257 288 ) ( 641 256 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 640 -208 288 ) ( 641 -208 288 ) ( 640 -208 289 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 256 288 ) ( 128 256 289 ) ( 128 257 288 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+// brush 5
+{
+( -416 256 48 ) ( -416 257 48 ) ( -416 256 49 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -432 256 48 ) ( -432 256 49 ) ( -431 256 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( -432 256 48 ) ( -431 256 48 ) ( -432 257 48 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 288 ) ( 128 273 288 ) ( 129 272 288 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 -32 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 64 ) ( 129 272 64 ) ( 128 272 65 ) bolt3 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 272 64 ) ( 128 272 65 ) ( 128 273 64 ) bolt3 [ 0 1 0 32 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+}
+// entity 1
+{
+"classname" "info_player_start"
+"origin" "-292 0 72"
+}
+// entity 2
+{
+"classname" "func_detail_illusionary"
+"_mirrorinside" "0"
+"_shadow" "-1"
+// brush 0
+{
+( 0 823.1111111111112 48 ) ( 0 826.3333333333334 48 ) ( 0 823.1111111111112 49 ) grate1 [ 0 1 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 0 -192 48 ) ( 0 -192 49 ) ( 1 -192 48 ) grate1 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 0 823.1111111111112 48 ) ( 1 823.1111111111112 48 ) ( 0 826.3333333333334 48 ) grate1 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 1287.1111111111113 272 ) ( 128 1290.3333333333335 272 ) ( 129 1287.1111111111113 272 ) grate1 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 -1 0 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 224 64 ) ( 129 224 64 ) ( 128 224 65 ) grate1 [ 1 0 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+( 128 1287.1111111111113 64 ) ( 128 1287.1111111111113 65 ) ( 128 1290.3333333333335 64 ) grate1 [ 0 1 0 0 ] [ 0 0 -1 0 ] 0 1 1
+}
+}
+// entity 3
+{
+"classname" "light"
+"origin" "-136 24 148"
+"delay" "2"
+}
diff --git a/tests/test_ltface.cc b/tests/test_ltface.cc
index 1f346aed..cf2470ff 100644
--- a/tests/test_ltface.cc
+++ b/tests/test_ltface.cc
@@ -852,3 +852,26 @@ TEST_CASE("q1_sunlight")
     auto [bsp, bspx, lit] = QbspVisLight_Q1("q1_sunlight.map", {"-lit"});
     CheckFaceLuxelAtPoint(&bsp, &bsp.dmodels[0], {49, 49, 49}, {0, 0, 0}, {0, 0, 1}, &lit);
 }
+
+TEST_CASE("q1_light_bounce_litwater without the water")
+{
+    auto [bsp, bspx] = QbspVisLight_Common("q1_light_bounce_litwater.map", {"-omitdetail"}, {"-lit", "-bounce", "4"}, runvis_t::no);
+    CheckFaceLuxelAtPoint(&bsp, &bsp.dmodels[0], {118, 118, 118}, {128, 12, 156}, {-1, 0, 0});
+}
+
+TEST_CASE("q1_light_bounce_litwater")
+{
+    INFO("adding a water plane should not affect the amount of light bounced on to the walls");
+
+    auto [bsp, bspx, lit] = QbspVisLight_Q1("q1_light_bounce_litwater.map", {"-lit", "-bounce", "4"});
+    CheckFaceLuxelAtPoint(&bsp, &bsp.dmodels[0], {118, 118, 118}, {128, 12, 156}, {-1, 0, 0});
+}
+
+TEST_CASE("q1_light_bounce_noshadow")
+{
+    INFO("make sure light doesn't both pass through and bounce off of a face with _shadow -1");
+
+    auto [bsp, bspx, lit] = QbspVisLight_Q1("q1_light_bounce_noshadow.map", {"-lit", "-bounce", "4"});
+    CheckFaceLuxelAtPoint(&bsp, &bsp.dmodels[0], {118, 118, 118}, {128, 12, 156}, {-1, 0, 0});
+}
+